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Riding after rain screws the trails
Just a little example of what riding during and after rain does to the trails. I have attached 2 pics. The 1st is a shot of a section of trail that has seen heavy usage after recent rain. It is a pretty lazy corner that has seen heeeaaappss of riders through. It is very rutted and blown out now. It will need a good half day of rock armoring to survive the long haul.
the 2nd pic is taken of a very similar corner. It is on a section of trail that isn't seeing much traffic as a result of the works on the sewage plant. There is evidence of 2 bikes going through.
The point behind this post is simple. We are working to gain respect and credibility from land managers. We are also working towards having sustainable trails for a long time to come. Stay of in the trails after rain.
The good thing about Grock is that the trails drain very well. 3-4 days of dry can clear up most downpours. Especially if there is high winds.
I think we need to have a trail open/closed system like they have at Manly Dam.
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Why I didn't go out yesterday arvo. That kind of thing used to happen to my local trails in Ashton Court in Bristol. The rain + bikes killed the trails, was a nightmare.
Well said.
However - there no longer seems to be an official open/closed system at Manly Dam. To be honest why should there be? I mean, riders should all know when not to ride, there really is no excuse.
Frustrating as it is, please stay away from single track when it's wet.
The northern beaches councils close the playing fields when it rains via a wet weather line. There are times that they close them all and there are other times where they just close the ones that drain poorly on a list and if your games on that field then its postponed or cancelled. The wet wether line gets updated around 5pm each night and they can reopen the fields during the weekend if they get good drying conditions and no rain.
Soccer also allows the local clubs to close fields and the referees also have the right to stop play if the conditions are bad. Seems like mtb really only has the last two options where sites like this can offer an opinion on the track and individuals can decide if conditions are ok.
No idea what it would take to extended the council system for mtb tracks like manly dam.
Manly Dam was closed on Sunday?
A group from my Gym was going to go there, not sure if they did or not.
The red light was certainly on here, but no update on the council website. Went to centennial park instead for 3 1/2 hrs of road laps.
My sleep-in was vindicated?
At least up at G-rock you guys can get out there and do maintenance after clueless people ruin the trail. Down here at Manly Dam we can't do anything about it. Even after 10 times the amount of traffic goes through the place when the trail is sodden.
How do we get the message out to punters that either don't get online to check a status, have no idea one exists or even don't give a crap?!
give a crap-short & simple!!!
Realistically I don't think there is anything you can do to stop the real idiots unless someone is prepared to put a ranger or similar in there issuing fines.
For the rest of us, maybe a little info would help. But it needs to be accurate otherwise it will just get ignored.
Plus for it to be properly useful I reckon it would need to reflect conditions on a trail by trail basis. Some trails cope with wet weather a lot better than others but then traffic comes into play if you start concentrating everyone onto just a few trails (as evidenced by the photos). So it would be a bit of a balancing act.
I'll be honest and say the only reason I didnt ride in the last two days is because I got caught up with other things. Now seeing what it's like, it looks like I didn't miss out on much, but I would otherwise have only found out once I got there. TBH pretty hard to turn around and head back home once you've put an hour or so into getting there.
The best concept I've heard for keeping moto's out is to make the trails too tight and windy at moto speeds for them to enjoy the riding.
I am sure there are people who don't care but I think that vast majority would be happy doing the right thing but knowing what that is can be difficult. I live in Allambie and so it is darn obvious when places like the Dam and red Hill are going to be too wet but for people coming from other parts of Sydney, especially those that don't ride all that often, they are not necessarily aware of this website which does not leave them many options with where they should look. We have the Warringah Council website which now permanently says "Open" and I know of at least one person who saw that it was open, headed to the Dam from over the harbour, parked at the school and really only realised that it was too wet when they were near the golf course which was all too late. There needs to be a recognised and accepted place where trails are officially marked as open or closed and, where possible, Open/Closed signs administered by council or representatives (we have friends who have looked after council facilities as they live close by so are “contracted” to unlock gates, etc.).
Further to this, if trails are properly built and, most importantly, maintained, they are going to deal with rain a lot better and therefore spend less time in a closed state. I appreciate that this is difficult for council, if only there were some sort of volunteer days.....!
I'd stick the bloody things up myself each time it was too wet!
I have been doing a bit of trail running lately (my wet weather option) and around the dam yesterday and on prior occasions judging by the sort of bikes (and by implication riders…) out, most probably do not have much of a clue. The majority of bikes I saw were very low end, and while that seems elitist, the riders probably do not even think to look at the council website, let alone here, or even understand what they are doing.
In reality this highlights the prior issue where decent planning needs to occur to manage everyone’s expectations for using Manly Dam area – something for all recreational users. I believe if a proper resolution can occur, something which makes overt outcomes for both riders and walkers, some of this can be avoided.
For example, make a designated MTB single track (get away from the fire road) and thus an official MTB course, plus a separate walking trail (across the top by the golf course). Then as people recognize the ‘official’ nature of activity it may also be easier to administer and control in the wet as people respond to it.
As has been suggested by BT I would also be happy to help and take a roster to ‘close the trails’ (say flick signs from open to closed at logical starting points with where to look to check the status prior to arriving, and lock the boom/bar as per the old days) – I’d even help pay for the signs if that’s what’s needed. I appreciate not everyone will see, or know of the status before they arrive. But I am sure they will soon learn, and get the hang of it.
We will never stop riders ridng on wet trails. In fact, we all here will do it from time to time. There will always be a group that aren't aware, and there will be a group that don't care (which we will all slip into or out of from time to time)
As far as Glenrock is concerned, I think we need to have a sign up that points out that trails should not be ridden in the wet. Most riders access at GunClub road. So, I reckon a sign saying stay out after rain is the best way forward.
Charlie B. Are you talking about Manly Dam or Glenrock inyour post??
I'm talking about Manly Dam. A bit far away to help you up north...
I think it's a good idea to have people that are that dedicated that they would put up signage that indicates closure, however i think that there will be times when people just don;t have the time to do this. At Glenrock, we have a large notice board at the main access point. Maybe you guys down there can put up a sign each time, I think up here in Glenrock, we can put a permanent sign up reminding people to not ride in the wet.
The only way I can see open/closed signage working is if the NPWS were to take it on board, otherwise I think it'll just be a burden to someone.
I agree that a permanent sign is about all you could do. Maybe NPWS include this for the main entry points when they start to roll the signage out (in the near-ish future I believe?)
Actually at the noticeboard it might even be nice to have some simple signage for trail etiquette and cover wet trails in that.
Not sure if they are still there but the noticeboard used to have the MTBA riders code of conduct.
I was thinking something a bit more visible but also keep it nice and simple.
Pretty easy to ignore something stuck to a notice board, but if the message is nice an visible to everyone who passes by the hopefully it will sink in (maybe wishful thinking?).
Yep, I agree. I think we need a permanent addition to the board. The code of conduct is still there. There will always be those that ignore any sign, however if a punter comes and see's a more prominent sign, next time they think about going for a ride the day after heavy rain, they just might recall the sign, and go to Awaba instead.