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Cape to Cape on a 1 x 10
I was just wondering if anyone did the race sans front derailleur?? or even a 2x10, and just wondering how you went on the climbs mainly day 1, although there were a few granny gear climbs on day 2 early on.
I am looking at a new bike, but am not really sure if I want to go that way. Not that I want to buy a bike to do 1 race, but I would like to be able to do the cape to cape on it again next year. Bike wise I am thinking a santacruz tall boy or a yetti sb95, so going to move to a 29er.
I did the cape to cape this year on a triple with a 11-34 cassette (Specialized Epic). on a number of the climbs I was in full granny, but did find I ran out of gears on the flat big chainring was a 39 I think. I wasn't particularly competitive in the race as I rode it with a slower mate and we just stuck together, so i was largely just out having fun rather than racing. I was able to ride most of the climbs and only had to push on day 1. Heart break hill I pushed and the next one that followed and maybe one other section after the water truck, but the last two were more a result of the track being blocked with other riders pushing so I had no choice, rather than lack of gears. I think day 2 early there was one hill that I rode which was that steep at the crest I was struggling to keep the front wheel on the ground, but fortunately it was only a short climb.
Fitness/strength is reasonable, I ride a lot of road. I do the camel farm loop in a comfortable 1.20 for both laps. Balboa climb I can do on the middle chain ring, but I find the granny just gives me a bit more speed when you need it on some of obstacles, rather than grinding in the middle ring.
So not sure which way to go. I like the idea of the xx1, but I guess cassettes and chains/ chainrings might be expensive consumables. So it might be a 10x2 option that is best.
cheers
Clint
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You'd have no worries on a 2x10. I've recently changed my setup on my bike from 3x10 to 2x10 and I love it. If my Strava segment times are anything to go by, then I'm definitely faster now (may or may not be a result of fitness instead).
In the Cape to Cape you'd be better off on a 2x10 rather than a 1x10. I think the range between the steep climbs and the fast fire roads is too great for a 1x10. If you are crazy enough to ride a single speed, then you could probably get used to grinding it out on the climbs.
Short answer: You'll be fine with 2x10 on the C2C (I was and doesn't sound like I'm as fit as you!) but as Big Mike says, you'd need to be pretty fit to cover the range of terrain and the length of some of the days on a 1x10.
Long answer: It's not really about 1x 2x or 3x, its about what gear ratios 'you' need, and how to best provide them on 'your' bike. For example, I recently went from 3x9 on a 26" to 2x10 on a 29er, and didn't lose anything in terms of top and bottom range, but just cut out a lot of duplication in the middle - but that was because I chose my chainrings and sprockets carefully (even waiting until Shimano launched a lower version of their XT double, so I wouldn't lose anything on the bottom end).
So, I suggest you spend some quality time with a good gear calculator, like this one http://sheldonbrown.com/gears/ Start by working out the gear inches of the smallest and largest combination you currently use (ones you really use, not that are there but never used), and then play around on the gear calculator with combinations of 2x and 1x to see if you can keep those top and bottom gears while still having reasonable granularity in the middle. Bear in mind while doing this that there are certain design limits that you'll need to stay within, such as the smallest commonly available rear sprocket being 11T, and the largest 36T (not counting XX1), and that you don't want to get a larger difference than 14T between the two front chainrings or shifting starts to get real ugly!
PS: Just noticed you're also moving from 26 to 29er, so make sure you factor that into your gear calculations as well, because it makes a difference! Sheldon's gear inches calculator above will take that into account.
Just remember that a 29r is approximately 11% higher geared than a 26r for the same cogs. A 26 in 22x36 is lower geared than a 29r with same gearing. To get equivalent revs/speed on a 29r you would need to go to a 20 granny (20x36). I believe most 2x10 systems run 24-38 chainrings and some won't allow a smaller granny ring due to the BCD in the spider being larger than the normal 3*10 systems. You don't say what size granny ring you using on your 3*10.
At 80 cadence the following are the speeds of 26r and 29r in 'granny' gear and 36 cog using nominal tyre diameter sizes.
26r 22/34 = 6.45kph
26r 22/30 = 7.34kph
26r 22/36 = 6.10kph
26r 24/36 = 6.65kph
29r 24/36 = 7.34kph
29r 22/36 = 6.73kph
29r 20/36 = 6.12kph
These differences may not seem much BUT you may be walking the 29r up grades you would ride a 26r up. Note that the 26r with 22*30 (your second lowest gear with one gear lower to go), is the same as the 29r with 24*36, but without a lower cog, so you may end up walking earlier. So choose the gearing available on your 29r carefully.
I'm not that good a climber so I need low gearing on the 29r, currently I'm running 2*10 with 20/34 chain rings and 11/36 cassette, but when I switch to a 3*10 (for long distance stuff) I use 20/30/40 chainrings. Whatever gearing you choose make sure the front der is adjustable for smaller rings and that the gearing suits you and that the front der has the capacity to cover the ring sizes, most seem to have a 15 tooth capacity between small and large rings (eg. 20/35 or 24/39).
HTH ANC
yeh, I was thinking I could maybe swap out chain rings for the various days on the cape2cape. But as you say both day 1 and 2 there were sections I was on granny ring and then spinning way to fast in the big ring on the descents and the flats. Although I must admit the last 10kms or so on day 2 probably didn't see me spinning too much in a big gear
but I doubt you could cover it all with a single ring (at least with my legs).
But as you say 2x10 might be the way to go. If I want to save a few grams, I am probably cheaper off and better off to loose it off me
Thanks for the calculator, I hadn't thought too much about that, but I will pay a bit more attention to what gears I am mainly running in and select from there based on the change to 29.
Cape2cape was great though, I'm still smiling about it. even contemplating a day trip to do the pines without the big train.
Quote "there were sections I was on granny ring and then spinning way to fast in the big ring on the descents and the flats"
Yeah, tell me about it - according to my computer I topped 70kph at one point on day four - I don't think I've ever gone that fast before - even on a road bike!
Quote "even contemplating a day trip to do the pines without the big train"
Had exactly the same thought meself, and have just booked a weekend down there...
I second all of the good info above but would also say that you can train in a way to make a 1 x 10 set up more plausible.
A few years ago I built up a single speed & after struggling for a while found that fast spinning & slow hill climbing grinds were a realistic alternative to constantly hunting for that optimum 80rpm or so cadence as long as the terrain isn't too extreme. Don't get me wrong, racing events like this on one gear (IMHO)is for the super strong, bearded oddballs & Luddites, but as an experiment & training method it makes you a stronger rider. I'd guess on a 29er a front ring of 32 & rear 11-38 would be about right.
That said, I have still occasionally run out of gears on the 2x10 27/39 f 11-36r 2x10 set up on my 29er but this is due to my lack of fitness on hills & spinning out at around 56kmh.
I have a 40th at smiths beach next month and have been told I'm not aloud to take my bike!! but I think I will have to take it though now that I think about those trails. There were also a couple of nice sections early on day 2. but I can't seem to see anywhere that they are listed, and there would be no way I could find them again.
yeh I had a couple of firsts too. Day 1, I managed to ride a little way up heart brake before it became too much with the crowd, and I had my heart rate up at 196 (I thought for a 39 year old was fairly high, if I hammer up balboa I'm maxing out at 180). Then I hit 68km on that descent through the fire trail in the karri forest. I didn't realise I was going that fast at the time (bit scary afterwards when you consider the consequences), but I had a clear run at least. I'm the same though the fastest pedalling on a road bike I got to was 65kmh just as I looked at my speedo and thought shit thats fast, I got dropped by the group.
That descent off heart break hill was crazy too, a lot of it I couldn't even see the track for the dust.
how were those couple of guys on the Surly moon bikes. You know your rims are heavy when they have to drill the ali out to lighten them. But they seemed to be going along ok.
I have seen a couple of guys on single speeds in the car part at camel farm. I had wondered whether they got the whole way around. Something I had thought about building up. I have probably enough spare parts to build most of it up, just need a frame really and the hub and drive line.
I have also seen quite a few too cool for school guys pushing their funky looking fixies up hills too
camel farm loop doesnt have too many real bad climbs , i run 2x10 and never granny cog the front ringset , and even climbing up rocky B on KC loop im 2nd or 3rd in from easiest.
but im not game to lose the granny gear yet , its does come in handy !! elevator just to name one spot.
i think ull be fine with 2x10 , and when fitness , strength is there u can always go 1x10 to shave those few grams
XX1- 10-42 11-speed...
I ran 11-36/ 26-39 at CtC and never got close to running out of gears at either end.
ok cheers was that on a 29er? what rings did you run on each of the days?
I think he was suggesting an XX1 as a potential solution, but judging by the ratios he posted he actually ran a 2x10 himself on the C2C.
I think a lot of people have their eye on that XX1 to see how it performs over time, and are hoping the technology trickles down to a more affordable groupset (currently $1,700 to set yourself up in XX1 versus $400 for a complete XT 2x10 groupset).
By the way, there was a guy on here couple of weeks ago going to do the C2C single speed - http://perthmtb.asn.au/node/38427 - wonder how he got on?
He lost all his strength after shaving his beard off and they're still out searching for his body
A couple of quick things.
There was at least 2 1x 10 riders in the top 20 at the C2C. They kept up in the front bunch on Day 4 with absolutely no problem and climbed the hills the rest of the week. Those hard hills on day 1 were climbed by most of the top riders so don't be worried about what you can do.
With the XX1 most of the bikes will come with a 34 and 32 front ring to interchange. The XX1 Epics we have in the shop definitely do as do the other Spec models that are on the way.
Hi - I'm having a little trouble figuring out the Sheldon Brown site. Well, just the wheel size selection. I'm not quite sure what each option means exactly.
The three different tyres I want to compare are -
A standard road bike 23x700c. (700x23 / 23-622)?
A 26er 2.1 MTB tyre. (26x2.125 / 54-559 MTB)?
A 29er 2.4 MTB tyre. (29 inch nominal)?
I think I chose the correct selection...