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What would you do?
Ok, a bit late I know but I hate typing!
A while ago while doing the Woodford to Glenbrook classic, a friend and myself were at the pointy end of the field and on the way down on the quickest, steepest part of the trail. We'd been passing, and being passed by a couple of mates in team kit of a local, well known shop in the mountains. I got I front at the top of the hill and presumed my mate would catch me at the bottom and we'd work together till the finish. A train of three of said shop guys and another rider caught me at the bottom and we all worked together till the end, I have to admit, we were really motoring and all the guys were taking turns at the front, we had a blast and all sprinted for the line in a friendly kind of way. We shook each others hands and shared stories of the race, on of the guys in the team kit came to me and told me he'd knocked my mate off back up the hill but thought he was ok?
After waiting, and waiting, and waiting, I'd decided to go back to my car where I got a phone call from the hospital, it was my friend, asking me to go back and pick his son up who was pushing his bike to the bottom of the trail.
I went to pick up his son then took him to his Dads car to wait for someone to come and get him and pick up the car.
Back in Sydney I found out that my mate was on a super fast left handed corner when someone just simply rode into him from the side at very high speed, he'd basically tumbled off his bike, broke his shoulder blade in multiple places, smashed his $400 helmet to bits, banged up his pelvis really badly and was covered in blood and bruises.
This guy works for himself and his insurance doesn't cover him while racing, he's lost well over ten grand in loss of income plus all medical fees.
This guy was one of the fittest guys in his age group and riding is( or was ) his life. Now he seems to have lost his drive to race again, saying that, having had a few accidents in the past that this one is the last straw and he can't afford( his pocket and his body!) to have any more accidents.
What's really pee'd him off is that, all he wanted was an apology from the guy, so he rang the said shop and they've denied any knowledge of the crash even though we know who a couple of the riders are!
I thought I'd post this just to get a few people's thoughts on the matter, please don't mention any shop or personal names as this is a public forum and I'd rather people didn't.
At every race it's always stipulated that if you see an insured rider, stop and help. I think it's pretty bad form you should knowingly knock someone off and not stop just because you don't want your mate to beat you!
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wow. that's a crappy story.
In my books that's an absolute shocker. In a race if there is a rider down due to injury then you stop (unless there are already people stopped helping and you can't offer something extra). If you knowingly cause the accident you stop. In a race situation the only time you could be excused for not stopping is if it's a mechanical as I believe race organisers don't even send help if its a mechanical. I still ask if they are ok.
Well, you're only telling one side of the story and it might be nice to hear the other before getting too worked up, but...
All I can say from this though is that it's an absolute disgrace to hit someone, later admit you know you hit them but not stop at the time. It's just inexcusable.
As for the financial and other losses, if they are as great as you say perhaps it's worth looking into what sort of action can be taken? You all probably signed wavers saying the organisers could not be held responsible for any such injury (and why should they be - the incident isn't their fault), but what about other riders?
FWIW, (and I know this won't help your mate Gazza, but perhaps it might help others) I have three different types of insurance: for injury that would force time off work, for permanent disability and for death (touch wood and all that none but that last one will ever be needed - and not for long time either!). If you are self employed it just makes sense to have this. It's part of the deal with a super fund and not as expensive as you'd think, although all insurance is expensive until you need it, right?
Anyhow - I hope your buddy gets well soon and gets back on his bike and back to his form. If the other party can man up and do the right thing then all the better.
Can you call that hit and run? If the guy you spoke to at the shop afterwards wasn't the guy that told you he'd knocked your mate off...I'd be trying to get a hold of that guy, even if he doesn't own up just to give him some dirty looks about it.......
Sorry to hear about your mate Gaz. I work for myself too and what you described is fear that constantly sits at the back of my mind every time I get on the bike. Particularly after breaking my shoulderblade back in January.
Obviously what happened to your mate is terrible and the twat that did this showed really bad form, which was inexcusable and unsporting. He really ought to be blacklisted/banned from racing for showing that behaviour - it other sports can do it why not MTB? and the team (LBS) should also dishout some form of reprimand on the rider too. If you know the guy who did this I would go and have words with him and the owner of the LBS.
At the very least your friend deserves an apology.
Inexcusable behavior, some of these twats think they are racing for a block of flats. The knob should be banned for 12 months from any race to learn a lesson. The impact and crash most likely was unintentional we could assume but fuck you don't continue on until you know the person is up and running. People need to remember .... WE RACE FOR FUN!
Name and shame I say ... Lie in the bed that you make...
Fankles...
But that's not up to me to publish it!
Gazza, he admitted to being involved in an accident with your mate and continued to ride on. At every MTB event i have been to it has been announced numerous times that if you see a rider down you stop and help for as long as its needed. This guy hasnt done this and if i were you, i would be reporting it to the event organisers. Clearly it was not a small tangle that caused the damage and he should be reprimanded for not stopping. Your mate is just lucky i guess that it wasnt a life threatening accident and he will pull through
I also say name and shame.... he thought he was polite by apologising to you for being involved in an acco with your mate, but really its his lame way of trying to make himself feel better!!! Dob the asshole in i say.
You have to be very careful about naming and shaming, in particular the wording about it. Calling people liars and alike via the forum can be considered defamation and although it maybe true if you were to be sued, not only would you be in trouble but NoBMoB would be as it would be vehicle for the comments.
Tough one Gazza, not a lot you can do unfortunately I guess.
Personally I wouldn't post names. I can't see anything to do with nobmob though as its a community forum.
Just wanted to share the difficult position my mate has been put in. We know who this guy is through looking at results and photos.
It's just a shame he didn't realize how serious his actions were on the day.
He even said to me that he was forced over by his mate but this was certainly no excuse not to stop.
That sucks, In the rules of this event they state that in the event of an accident you should not stop but rather move on to the next volunteer station so they can communicate and get immediate proffesional assistance from ambulance staff. But common sence should tell you that you stop to help and send someone else for assistance. In regards to the LBS gear, are you sure he works for them. I see alot of riders wearing LBS labeled gear that dont work for them.
Hope your friend gets well soon and gets back on the bike.
But definitely know he has an affiliation with them.
Thats really poor form. Not so much the contac tin the race (its racing, it happens), or even not stopping (it happens, its racing, people dont think straight) but the lack of apology afterwards and denial. Not cool.
I really dont think there is any recourse you can take though bud. I would be very very direct with the knob at the next race, and have him well aware of your thoughts.
Other than that - you (and the victim) should rest easy knowing the karma will get them. And probably pay interest too.
He's fully aware that people get carried away while racing but yes, He's furious that there was no apology or concern afterwards!
Its possible I know both parties I s'pose.
Either way, bad Karma. It will come back to the aggressor and reward you for your restraint.
What goes around comes around...
maybe a quiet word with the organisers / announcer for a special anonymous mention at the start next year, when he's lined up with his mates -
"Last year we had a would-be hero who t-boned one of the elite riders and put him in hospital and out of work for x months and didn't stop to see if he was OK, or even try to apologise afterwards. Let's not have that happen again, if you're involved in contact and someone comes off, stop to see if they are OK before you or the next rider notifies the next marshall"
....or something like that?
screw restraint. Kick him in the nutts. Wont achieve anything but you'll feel better
Gook luck to your mates recovery, he's got some luck in the bank surely after losing 10K
I like your style, but then i've never been known for my diplomacy!
If you know this guy's name, you may be able to contact him through the cycle shop, Facebook, Linkedin or just word of mouth. You could then send him a link to this thread.
Whereas the outcome was certainly very unpleasant, I think you really need to give this guy the chance to understand his actions. Just state the situation clearly (specifically that he said to you and in front of others - "I took your mate out back there" and then advise of the position it has put your mate in (injury, loss of work, loss of lifestyle etc).
Then ball is then firmly in his court to take action. There could be any number of reasons as to why he didn't stop or take further action (granted these might be pretty flimsy) but IMO he needs to be given the opportunity to demonstrate his remorse and ultimately take action.
The name and shame thing could lead to a great deal more serious repercussion for him. Again, even though your friend has not had a fun time to put it mildly, to drag this guy's name through the mud - in an age when a quick Google search can show a lot of information (both true, untrue and embellished) -could potentially affect not only his name in the cycling community but his job, his family's integrity, the shop that he MAY be representing, team mates etc.
Playing the bigger man is going to lead to a far more positive outcome I think.
Either way, best of luck with it.
but i wont be naming anyone.
What's really pee'd my mate off is that he's rang the shop and they've shrugged it off when clearly they know who it is.
Bad form really but hey, i suppose you have to look after your mates?
as others have said karma will sure too come his way otherwise he will be dealt with in other ways , does he do a lot of races that you know of ? Good luck too the healing process for your mate & hope he keeps on pedalling.
Hard one, this.
Racing crashes happen through sometimes small mistakes, although cleaning up someone on a high-speed corner is just plain reckless. Not at all impressed that he failed to stop to check on your friend. How does anyone assume that a crash on a fast bit of track is going to have anything less than major cosnequences?
Very poor form indeed.
So what do you do? Taking matters into your own hands and trashing his reputation for revenge turns you into as much of a tosser as he.
I think taking a note of his name and mentioning the crash to race control at every event he shows up at that you are also at, and requesting a special mention at the safety briefing of
* a bad collision "at a recent race" through reckless passing
* the personal injury and financial consequences to the victim your friend
* the rider (unnamed) who caused the crash not stopping being especially bad form and
* Absolute responsibility of riders involved in a collision to stop and check on all other riders involved before continuing
for the next year would I think make the point sufficiently well in view of his apparent lack of remorse.
Gaz, sorry to hear about your mate.
Get the fellow's number, ask for the apology, pass on your mate's details, and let the two of them sort it out. Just act as the initial intermediary so your mate can get his apology. Gaz, it is very hard to get too defensive for your friend over an event you didn't witness.
Also, if your friend says he doesn't want to race any more, I say 'good on im!', as I have given this up too because it's a flamin rip off. No one is ever getting my money for letting me ride my bike.
Personally, I could also recommend that your mate get sickness and injury cover (aka total and temporary invalidity insurance) for his work. He is asking for trouble, well I suppose it found him first!, by not covering himself for these screw ups in a relatively risky form of sport.
Don't know if it's a freaky coincidense or sheer chance but 9 weeks after the accident and 24hrs after my post on here, the guy who caused the crash phoned my mate up to chat about what happened. I'm sure a few words would have been exchanged but his excuse was the rural fire brigade guy told him to keep going. I suppose that has some strength as it would get pretty dangerous having a bunch of guys gathered round an injured rider?
Still nO excuse for reckless riding though!
Hmm, the sceptic in me says no because erm, he's been reading this thread. However, I am glad to hear there's been a positive development and communication has begun.
Please pass on my best wishes and a speedy recovery to your mate Gaz.
Phil
it's not good what happened to your mate...BUT!!!
i clearly remember you saying at the finish line that your mate was on a new bike and that he rides like a loose cannon!
my mate(and i'm certain that some that have commented have riden with him) who was envolved in this witch hunt did STOP!.. and WAS! truely worried about the bloke but was told to move on by the firebrigde who were on that corner.
At the end of the day we all take risks when racing and it's easy to point the finger and put the blame on someone else when something goes wrong.
comments should really only be made based on 2 sides of a story not on what you THINK HAPPENED!!
jas
Whats the other side of the story then did did your mate run into him or not.
the other bloke went off line and clipped my mate when coming back in
You know what it doesnt matter.
What really matters is what your mate does now that will be the true test of his character.
I know what I would have done and would do if I was involved in an accident like this regardless of how much I was at fault.
But i cant say i said anything about a loose cannon?
all i'm doing is repeating on this forum what happened to a friend of mine. I'm telling the story from what i was told ok!
He was riding at speed when he felt like he was rugby tackled and ended up on the ground with multiple breaks in his shoulder blade and various other cuts, bruises etc.
Don't shoot the messenger pal!
the two parties have spoken so this thread doesn't need to continue
You dont have to justify yourself to this guy.