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Best tyres for the dam?
Hi folks,
I currently have tried a mix of ignitors, high rollers, fat slicks (my commuter, don't ask), wierwolfs ... and I'm not happy with any of them. I'm going to run the dam more regularly and may as well set my bike up or it specifically.
Can you friendly regulars give me your favourite tyre choice? Including front/rear pref if you have one?
Many thanks,
Ric
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What don't you like about those that you've tried? Wierwolfs are quiet heavy, non? I'd imagine a high roller would be OK.
FWIW I have Crossmarks on the Rush and they seem to work nice. There's a touch of wheel spin on the left golf course rock line and the steps after (if you take the centre line) - Ie. steep smooth rocks are on the edge. And they are a bit iffy on the deeper sand corner on the DH section, but, meh... I can live with that for the speed they roll. Hmmm... thinking further, they are a bit sketchy on the board walk right a the end, but what isn't sketchy on smooth, damp wood?
are expensive....why not try different pressures and stuff first? Suspension may also help with the handling. Try extremes of tune then settle for something in between that feels good.
hope it helps.
Craig
Yes, I should expand ...
The Ignitors (2.3) don't seem to roll well or grip in the sand. If I drop the tyre pressure they seem to lose grip which is counter intuitive. They also get real clogged real fast. I have one tyre on the front, not tried it on the back and probably won't bother. I was thinking crossmark/larsen for the back but hoping for the readers' expert confirmation on this.
The High Rollers are the exception version bought off torp7. At 2.1 they feel too small for the front. Run on the back at high pressure they roll ok, not great. I do like these tyres for soil & wet xc riding & won't be chucking them out (for example they feel great going up the roots before the golfclub carpark and around the singletrack), they just don't seem to be the right choice for the sand & sandstone of the dam.
Slicks - They were on my commuter when my heckler was in for a service. It was an impulse lap and they worked well when pointed dead straight (it was dry as a bone). Not too crash hot up hills, down hills or around corners.
Weirwolfs - Pretty heavy, they are old and ratty and replacing them has started me on this tyre choice journey. I know there's better out there!
I'm really looking for advice on a good all round setup for the dam. Something like crossmark/larsen on the back and Nevegals (???) on the front.
Any info is good. Tell me what you guys like for a quick lap
Ric
I have a lot of tyres.
My favourite are the ones which came with my bike - Hutchinson Barracudas. THey look a lot like High rollers. They aren't fast on the flat, but they are great for what I love - technical climbing.
I use 2.3 inch ones.
A crossmark on the back is great for Ourimbah, where there is no technical climbing to be found. For Oxford Falls and Red Hill, the Barracudas are winners. For Manly Dam they are great if you don't care about how fast you go on the fire trail.
Loads of people rave about Larsons on the back (many in combo with Crossmark on the front, but not sure this is for Dam like conditions, probably more suited to packed forest racing). Quiet a few like Nevegals but Ditty says they are a bit soft. I was going to try one of these options on the rear of a new build. The Maxxis Advantage look kindof nice too, might try one on the rear if I can find it.
Heckler runs a Minion DH front on the rear and seems to like it, don't recall what he has on the front.
Lots of XC riders are lazy like me and can't be bothered to swap out their Crossmarks front & rear between rides so stick with them.
The exception series are supposed to be lightweight for racing/XC use - I wouldn't use them even at the dam, word is their sidewalls are like paper. I put some of these on the GFs bike as they roll kindof nice and are light and have decent grip for her tiny bike/weight and she only likes firetrail so paper walls aren't an issue.
Ha bigger wheels have more grip.
If you must use 26inch wheels I once ran some Maxxis Rancheros that where pretty dam good.
i've got larsen tt on the rear & high roller on the front & pretty happy with the combo.
They are both 2.3 & i think they're to wide.
I'm due for new ones.
I'm gonna change both, down to 2.0. Gonna stick with larsen tt, but not sure 'bout the front though.
Matt
At the risk of making you more confused, I just about back on to the Dam and ride it regularly. I used to have 2.3 Ignitors on the front and Crossmarks on the back. I found rolling resistance on the 2.3 Ignitors a little annoying and the Crossmarks not great in terms of traction on technical climbs. I switched to 2.1 Ignitors on the front (still has the bite but rolls much nicer) and 2.0 Larsen TTs on the back (better stick on the climbs). I was chatting to Brad Preston from Bike Addiction during the week and he actually rides local trails with exactly the same set up.
Anyway, as you can see it is a very individual thing but just thought I would add my 2 cents worth.
Good luck.
Mick
Hello Ric
I came to the same conclusion as Mick, Ignitors and Larsens. In the past I loved Panaracer XC Fire Pro's but they are hard to get here, so I started using the 2.1 Ignitors on the front and I've been really impressed with the grip and how well they roll on hard surfaces (considering what they are). The 2.0 TT's are good on the back and roll really well, very good grip for hard pack XC tyres, and even in the wet loose stuff we have been having recently, quite impressive. I too echo Mick's comments about the Crossmarks (sorry Rob). I found them slippery on rocks/roots when climbing compared to the Larsens.
Personally I can't see the point of going over 2.1 for an all rounder. It sounds like you are going to be looking for a compromise really as the dam has a little bit of everything. Some prefer the roll, some prefer the grip, you won't get a combo that will excel at both I reckon. As Craig said above I would be looking at pressures and bike set-up.
Oh, and I too am like Rob, it's more about having a combo you like for ALL trails rather than just the dam, I just can't be bothered changing the tyres unless I really have to - I'm probably not helping am I?
Dylan
Thought I'd add to this. For 8hrs, enduros and most XC work I use Crossmark front and Larsen rear both 2.1 or 2.0 cannot remember. For general mucking around I use Conti Gravity front and larsen rear, these are 2.3s.
Tyre pressures, shock pressures and rebound also make a difference.
Cheers
Evan
I've been running 2.35 tubeless Ignitors on a hardtail. Run at around 32psi they grip fairly well but they do pack up fairly quickly. Rolling resistance is not great though ( no surprise there...) but they have been good for building confidence after a long time away from mountain biking.
I'm finally about to join the world of dual suspension and am hoping I can go for tyres which roll a little better. I tried out a Cannondale Rize demo bike at the weekend ( using my own wheels and tyres) and ran my ignitors at 40psi. Didn't grip too well and bounced off of rocks a fair bit so I dropped them to 32 psi again. That felt good again but they just feel too energy sapping when not on the technical stuff.
Anyway... anyone out there tried Racing Ralphs or Nobby Nics ? They look light and fast but very pricey....
CB
Excellent comments guys, thanks muchly. I think I did go and get an ignitor too large (2.35) for the front! The tiny high roller 2.1 exception's scared me off anything smaller than 2.3 but I've read they're quite small for a 2.1 and to me they're a simmillar width to a set of 1.95 slicks I've got.
The Barracuda, I forgot about them! I had them ages ago on the Heckler. I found they had quite good grip but when I leant to about 70 degrees they felt like slicks, they have a large surface area where there's no tread at all. Plus they were heavy for what they do.
How about:
Schwalbe - Nobbly Nic (front)
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?M...
Schwalbe - Racing Ralph (rear) in a 2.25?
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?M...
Bontrager - Jones 2.2?
Maxxis - ADvantage 2.25 (front)
http://www.maxxis.com/products/bicycle/product_d...
Maxxis - Crossmark 2.25 (rear)
http://www.maxxis.com/products/bicycle/product_d...
Wouldn't you be better off with the Advantage rear Crossmark front?
What hasn't been talked about here is are you tubeless or not? Sorry, I was looking for UST only tires so that had an impact on previous comments.
Think a few months back one of the mags had a nice review of loads of tires. Can't find mine at the mo, but will try and dig it out.
Yea the Maxxis Larsens came ot on top in that magazine test followed by Crossmarks. I ran some Larsens on my 26inch single speed for a while they where pretty good to.
2.0 Michelin Dry 2 on the front.
2.0 Maxis Larson on the back.
Does me for most XC riding. I just play with pressures (tires and shocks) to suit various trails. I suggest going as light as you can get away with, and running them as soft as you can get away with for grip, or increasing pressure for less rolling resistance / or if a trail with sharper rocks that partially stick out of the ground.
My bike came with a pair of 2.0 Crossmark Exceptions, they live in the garage. Anybody want them? Nearly brand new say.. $25 each, $49:50 for the pair (and I'll buy you a beer)?
I have been trying out Schwalbe Racing Ralphs in 2.25 inches for the past couple of weeks on one of my bikes - mainly on Terrey Hills and Cascades firetrails but havent tried them at the Dam yet given the wet weather. Have to say they are great - seem to roll and corner really well (corner much better than 2.1 Maxxis high rollers and 2.1 Maxxis Monorails I had previously without a lot of extra rolling resistance) and mud shedding was also pretty good. These are light too.
Other tyres which I like which dont seem to be that popular here are Specialized Fast Trak tyres - these come in lots of different compounds and widths but I run the 2.25 Control 2Bliss versions which actually look pretty narrow more comparable to 2.1 inch width. I ride these at the Dam alll the time and they are really fast and light - just be a little careful on some of the fast corners like down into the Creek as they feel like they might wash out before the side knobs start to bite. They now make a combined lightweight tyre for both tubes and tubeless that sells for $49 at Supreme Cycles Narrabeen
2.0 Crossmark Exceptions, should be "2.1".
SOLD!!
I've been a tyre nut for years, trying all sorts of things as my riding style has changed (and improved)
In the beginnning .... I was after a really secure tyre, lots of grip not so woried about weight.
As I got better I was more interested in weight than grip, and learned to ride 'looser'.
That said, I have 3 set of wheels (sooo extravagent you might say, but I build them myself, and recycle the hubs as rims need replacing over time)
I ride tubeless exclusively, and wouldn't dream of any other way, been doing it for years.
I do NOT use UST tyres, as they are all too heavy and defeat the purpose of light weight. Good old Stans does the job of sealing, whether on Stans Rims or Mavic crossmaxes. I DO take note of the recommendations on Stans site for which tyres are ok to run tubeless though.
Any tire will feel sketchy, and spin out up hills if run too hard, that too is relative, depending on your weight.
I'm usually 78Kg and run around 31-34psi front and 33-35psi rear in 2.1" tyres
I've got a set of 28mm rims, and can run 28 front and 32 rear happily with 2.3/2.3 tyres
Having got all that out of the way,
My current favorite setups are:
Crossmarks front and rear for anything fast (incl laps of the Dam) - they are not going to grip like a chunky tire, but heck you can't get the speed on a chunky tire anyway. A larson on the back running at 35psi will get seemingly imposible traction, and drifts nice and predictably at the limits. If you want a bit more grip from crossmarks 'on the limit' get a small set of sidecutters, and cut off all the round knobs on the edge. That gives a bit more space for the square knobs to grip the loose stuff. (anyone want's more info on that trick send me a message!)
My fun tyres are Kenda Nevegals, they are amazingly grippy for cornering, very forgiving of mistakes and roll reasonably well for a full knobby tyre. They are heavier than the crossmarks, and knock about 1-2 minutes off a lap of the dam by comparison. I use these on rides like old north road.
My 'do anything' wheels were up till recently maxis minion DH single ply on the front, and a larson 2.3 on the back. On 28mm rims these are bombproof. Now I have nevegals on them too, and the wider stance and low presuure gives me grip and reasonable rolling too.
I've tried Specialized Enduro and Adrenaline, both realy grippy tyres, but really heavy.
I couldn't get confident on ignitors, found their rounded profile too sketchy, tended to slide out rather than drift when the going got to the limits.
High rollers have good cornering, but their knob spacing is pretty rough on hardpack, and they wear down pretty quickly on sandstone.
There's lots more tires I've tried, contis, panaracer fire-x pro, even pythons (arrrgh)
So theres lots to try, but I can't emphisis enough the importance of pressure for each tyre, the terrain and the conditions. It's even worth keeping a notebook of what worked where with which tyre.
Whisperer
Great comments above. Cheers guys ... I'll be seen on the Dam this weekend hacking around on my Heckler with Noel's Crossmarks grinning like a halfwit no doubt
My tyre collection will grow to include nevegals and a racing ralph soon ... new toys new toys ...
Yes please Whisperer, tell me your secret setup for Xmarks!
The 'trick' of tuning crossmarks is something I originally read in a review by Competitive Cyclist:
Which tire is right for us?
Continental Explorer UST, Kenda Nevegal UST, Maxxis Crossmark UST, Kenda Small Block 8 UST
http://www.competitivecyclist.com/za/CCM?PAGE=PR...
Image of cut tyre:
The article is interesting in it's own right comparing tyres, but take note, they are all tubeless versions.
If you are going to 'cut' your tyres, it is a LOT easier if you use soapy water on the knobs. The pliers seem to slice through a whole lot easier and more cleanly.
W.
Ok, put the Crossmarks on the back and it was a new bike. I can't believe the difference! They went up everything with no problem. I've put the High Roller eXCeptions on the front & ditched the Ignitors ... From here I'll tinker slowly ... this works pretty well.
After the dam I went for a quick hoon at Terry Hills and it's a nice and quick combo. Very fun on flowy firetrails.
Thanks again all for your input
Hi Nick
Any update on the racing ralphs performance around the dam? ( assuming you've had a chance to do it)
CB
I have decided to keep the Racing Ralph 2.25 Evolutions for racing only given they are expensive (about $90 each) and hard to find in shops although someone found a website in Europe www.bike24.net that sells them pretty cheaply.
I am now running Maxxis Crossmark on the front and Maxxis Ranchero on the back (both tubeless). Pretty good combination - fast rolling and confidence inspiring on corners although a lot heavier that the Ralphs.