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Mystery Trail
Ive always seen the end of this trail and wondered were it went so after much googling found it connects up 2 a trail i frequently do (part 1) but the rest of the trail i could never do (part 2) because i don't no how to join it up?? Not even sure if part 2 is a trail i just saw a line on google maps so i assume it is. But as you can see even thou i end it where i do u can add a preitty decent amount of trail to the ride so maybe this has potential? It also could be very scenic most of the ride is along a river witch connects up to the harbour.
Ive drawn a route on google maps witch gives everyone a better idea.
http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa...
Any help would be amazing, wouldn't be surprised if someones already done the easter arterial leg.
Thanks,
Jono
[Mod: fixed up maps link]
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Most of this passes through National Park. Run away, run away!
Oh, yes, you would be allowed to run there, just not ride your bike
Part 2 is the fire trail at the end of the Two Creeks track. This leads around to Roseville marina. I haven't ridden this for well over a year but it is a nice ride, some really good single track.
... which is illegal. Please stay away unless you want to undermine the efforts of everyone working so hard to get something legal in our area. Eg: IMBA - NSW Trail Sustainability Forum and Workshop
There were no signs prohibiting bikes last time I rode here. When did it become illegal? And why?
Well, at least since May '08...
http://nobmob.com/node/5082
... but according to NPWS, this (riding single track in National Parks) has always been the rule, it's just they only bothered to tell us and start enforcing it couple years back. Side issue - many park PoM documents read in a way that seems to allow riding on single track at the discretion of the regional manager. Well, that's how I would interpret them, but sadly our regional manager doesn't see it that way so won't use his discretion and therefore there's no single track goodness here
The wider story is that ever since NPWS called and had their little 'chat' with us about 2 years ago we have been asked to point out that riding is only allowed on 'authorised' trails in National Parks. This is problematic since there is no real information available on what is 'authorised' and what is not. Indeed, I have confessions from NPWS that their own maps are incorrect on this account - not good, eh?
Given this lack of information, I personally (and this is just me - I'm probably in the wrong so don't do this yourself!) ride on any firetrail (as it's hardly likely a bike can damage a track built for a fire truck!) unless I have been specifically asked not to (in the case of Smiths Creek for example).
Single tracks are different though. We have been told there are no authorised single tracks in Sydney's National Parks, so if you come across one, don't ride it! There are some legal single tracks in the Blue Mountains NP (notably the section bottom of the Oaks) and Kosiosko NP (eg. Thredbo DH & XC tracks), and elsewhere in the state, so it's not that they are necessarily banned everywhere, just in our region. This is frustrating to say the least, but you already know that, eh?
Out of interest, you can walk along any single track you like, just not ride your bike (you'll have to carry or push it). Actually, the NPWS Walking Policy states you are allowed to walk anywhere you like, you don't even have to be on a formed track!
Anyhow, given the upcoming NPWS Workshop one would hope that something good will happen soon on this front.
That said, if you don't like the situation and feel you must do something, write to your local state member and the minister for the environment about it. Just be polite and stick to the facts is all.
Are you sure the track is illegal? There was a section that was closed and bypassed due to a rock slide, that is what the rangers are talking about in that post. The new section isn't really rideable, so you have to push through it.
Also, most of the track is outside of the NP, there's only a small section in the middle that's in the park.
I have a Google Earth file of these, came from some Geo-caching site and don't recall the URL.
However, you can view NPWS borders easily on any topo map and if you don't have topo maps, you can view them online at the Department of Lands:
http://maps.nsw.gov.au/
There's also some nicer Sydway imagery freely available there which is a bit clearer and shows the tracks we're discussing here:
They are currently marked as walking tracks which means no riding.
Note there is no track marked between the two and also note the 'Garigal National Park' labels.
So the fire trail from Archbold Rd to the stairs is ok and the section east of the NP is ok? Just need to push through the NP?
@LetThemEatCake... Why don't you just call up NPWS and ask them?
or just mapped it on GE?
I ask because the section where you come to a "T" intersection, if I am right, crosses a small river. There is a wooden bridge there that has been in a rapid state of decline since I first started riding 2 creeks. It has always been closed to use and has looked more dangerous every time I went past. I haven't ridden there since before that post that Rob referred to but I have heard that alot of the boards have been removed so I don't believe you'll be able to make that crossing there, even if you are only on two feet.
Must say that I agree with Rob, it was my understanding that track was off limits. It will be interesting to see what they say Letthemeatcake, please report back as it was one of the "prettier" rides around here
Ive ridden part 1 (the pipe run) and i was just curious to know if anyone knew how to join part one up with part two due to there being a river and everything to cross. It could be a fun ride if i could extend it further.
I haven't been down there for years, but the link between the pipeline track and two creeks track was never a "ride" in any meaningful sense. A nice walk with your bike maybe (if you like carrying it), but it was never even a well formed walking track, just a track worn by use.
I've walked the track along the water to 2 Creeks a few times - forget about riding it unless you are happy getting off your bike every 20 metres and scrambling over logs/up rock faces etc. with your bike on your shoulders.
I've also ridden the 2 Creeks track from Eastern Arterial to Roseville Marina once or twice (before I knew it was illegal) ..... and yes it is illegal .... or at least NPWS and its rangers think it is and they are often there on a weekend handing out fines to dog walkers as well (no dogs allowed in National Parks, even on a leash)
The Forestville office isn't picking up the phone this morning.
Confirmed by the Forestville office. The Firetrail from Archbold Rd to the steps is legal. The single track from the steps to the eastern boundary of the park is push / carry only and the single track from the eastern boundary to Babbage Rd is council land and legal.
Interesting - how far does that make the push then roughly?
I think its about 1km. The section from the steps to the end of the bypass is unridable by all but the best technical riders anyway. I think there's about another 500m of sniggle after that. some of this is also pretty tough going, especially on the way up. The eastern boundary is marked by a green routered sign.
Might be time for a ride here soon.
Yeah sounds feasible if it's only a K or so
I checked with the NPWS at Forestville & they confirmed that bikes on NP walking tracks in any form, ridden, pushed or carried, is not permitted. & anyone riding the walking track risks a $300 fine. Only the fire trail section of Two Creeks Track is legal to ride.
The statement that, "...bikes on NP walking tracks in any form, ridden, pushed or carried, is not permitted" is not correct.
While it is illegal to ride on any unauthorised trail, the cycling policy[1] point 5 clearly states, "Cyclists are permitted to push or carry bicycles on tracks or trails where cycling is not permitted."
[1] http://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/resources/park...
k09, looks like you've been given a bum steer by whoever you checked with at "NPWS at Forestville" - would be great to know who you spoke to, so we can get them sorted out with the accurate position... (given that the rules seem to be pretty clear that you need to carry your bike through sections that you can't ride on).
[apart from anything else, it would be a funny kind of a police state if NPWS could start regulating what I carry around with me!]
we all want to work together with NPWS and everyone else with an interest in land management, and it must suck to have been mislead in this way - let's help get the record straight, and try to ensure that all parties know what the 'real story' is, so that each group works with the others.
Obviously, if whoever pulled the wool over your eyes with this one thinks they can continue down a path of mis-truth, then we'll end up with each side not trusting the other.