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What to do?
I was cleaning up the Taurine to sell it the other day when my heart sank,
I'd found a crack on the rear brakemount.
I was going to put it on here and on ebay but instead i took it to Bike Addiction as i heard from a mate that they fic up carbon frames,
Upon close inspection, The guy who does the magic recons that it's probably only a crack in the paint(as its had a custom respray), as the crack is at the front of the mount and the way the brake works it would be pulling at the back of the mount and pushing down at the front so if ant cracks should apear, they should be at the back of the mount. also, he said that the dropout is alloy which would probably mean the dopout is alloy also and it would be bonded onto the carbon further up the seatstay. The crack could be caused by paint shrinkage/brake vibrations or both.
My dilema is, what the hell do i do?
I wanted to sell it as a whole bike as i think i'd get more for it than selling it in bits.
Although it does have some nice bits,
2011 2x10 XTR groupset, Cannondale Hollogram cranks, Mavic crossmax SLR's, thomson masterpeice and Selle Italia Carbon railed SLR saddle, Alloy Lefty Dlr/OPI fork
Weight 9.1kg's
Please, No Crack'n'fail jokes!!!
I'ts not a warranty job either as i've voided that by having the respray!
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Sounds like you've got yourself some wall art there. You can't sell a frame that's cracked for anything other than 'scrap value' - it just wouldn't be right
Keep the parts for the next build and hang the pretty frame on your wall
I wouldn't be so sure you've got no warranty, there is such a thing as statutory warranty but you'd need to argue that your respray would have no impact and back it with a report. Probably more hassle than you want.
There's a guy in Melbourne who ultrasounds carbon frames and can tell you if you have a real crack. He warrants repairs for 5 years. Google on carbon fibre frame repairs Melbourne and you will find it. The name is something like Luescher Tecnics
Its not a huge amount of help, but Trek do warranty frames for paint cracks. I have seen a few where ther front fork has a 'crack' about 1 inch above the drop-out. Its where the alloy dropout is bonded into the carbon fork and the difference in flex between the two causes a 'crack' to appear.
They accept responsibility as they have not made the paint elastic enough to cope. Structurally, there is nothing wrong with the fork.
Maybe "Can-or-Drain" do that with their bikes too? (see how I avoided a 'crack-and-fail' joke there?)
On a seperate matter, you just cant sell even a potentially cracked frame. I certainly couldnt. I wouldnt sleep at night. I know you wouldnt consider it either, karma is a bitch on these things.
Bad luck though - the worst feeling ever finding those sorts of things....
It was a second hand frame when I got it.
Think I'll have to split the parts and put it all on eBay.
I'll point out the problem with the frame and someone might buy it for a fix up project.
Ants, I'd never want to sell anything dodgy, I agree, karma's a bitch!
As for Crack'nFail, I'm sticking by the brand, thats all i ride and I bloody loves em I do and that's what I'm saving my pennies for next. One with big wheels though! Gotta keep up with you trendsetters!
It's under compression rather than tension. It'll probably last forever.
looks like you just got yourself a carbon single speed bike. sell the parts and build an sser
Bloody hate the things!
why don't you strip it back then you can see for yourself?? The guy in Melb is in the latest MBA issue www.carbonbikerepair.com.au seems to know his stuff + there are a few other mentioned in the article
I'll give you $1000 as is.. regardless of crack.
Maybe if you advertise that it comes with free crack you'd get more takers?
You can have the cranks and the wheels for a grand mate!
your connections with Cracknfail, I'd be doing my best to get an email address of one of the tech guys at their head office. Then send them an email with pic attached asking if that is where a stress crack would appear or exactly where the bond joint would be. Atleast then you can sell the frame as is with some confirmation from someone a little more knowledgeable about their product than a local guy that you might well be best mates with (not saying at all that you are trying to pull a swifty, clearly that isn't the case.)
I would suggest that, given it is already a second hand frame, and one that has been raced hard at that, I don't believe you would recover the cost of any frame repair. I also think that you would make more money by parting the bike out, and think this would have been the case even without the crack.
Good luck with it.
The Brakes and Grouppo are worth over $1000 alone on the 2nd hand market.
Gazza aint stupid!
hence the
face
I still havent got around to designing the sarcasm font.
p
And I couldn't find a disgusted face to reply to you but I think this is what you were looking for,
@ Kit, I recon you're right about splitting it up, do you think I should keep the groupset together though?
Any other thoughts on what you'd pay for the rest of the stuff?
Cracks will never appear on the compression side, the component needs to be in tension for any cracks to appear. Personally, I'd keep riding it with not a worry in the world. If you really want to sell it take it back to the carbon dude at BA and ask for an ultrasound to be done and then once they found nothing get it re painted.
Most bike shop employees wouldn't know a crack in carbon if it hit them in the face. Ultrasonic is one of the only ways to tell it is a surface indication or if the indication penetrates the carbon layers. You want find a bike shop who has ultrasonic equipement as it is expensive or the personel with the experience to use it, as the AS for Ultrasonic qualification is quite specialisied. There are some commerial NDT (non destructive testing) companies that could carry this out for you, probably relatively cheap. Southern cross inspection services may be able to help, there are others, just search on line. I know some one in Melbourne, thats not much good.
sorry Gaz, I have no experience at parting out bikes so couldn't give you an answer based on experience. If I were to look at it logically though, a new grouppo is cheaper than the sum of all its parts so I would expect that the resale price of a second hand grouppo would follow suit, ie I would think you'd get more money selling things as individual components. Of course the down side is you may get stuck with one or two items.
I think in this case it's likely that compressive force may squash/compress the seatstay under brakes and caused the crack. If this is the case, the seatstay is compromised. Gazza - have you tried holding the rear brake on and rocking the bike back and forth to see if there is any movement?
I'll try it in the morning.
I've just realized that I took insurance out not long ago against breakages etc on the bikes but don't really want to make a claim and use up browny points with the insurance company. If it was a brand new bike that I'd just ran over in the car then that'd be worth a claim.
Fire up the Van Gaz...!
Try Quantam bikes off Scarborough Beach road North Perth. Aldo there has been doing carbon bike repairs for years - does dye testing for cracks - would be perfect for this one.
GAZZA, road trip sounds good. Get your bike repaired and escape this crappy weather. I'll just check how much leave I have
Can i Book a seat on the Cannondale Express???
If we get the timing right we could do the Cape to Cape!
Could also show you guys the Goat Farm and surrounding trails, Jarrahdale and Pinjarra. That'll make it all worthwhile...
As advised, I moved the bike back and forth with the brake on and there's a bit of movement in the crack so it's not just the paint.
Anyone had any experience in insurance claims? How much do they put your premium up after a claim?
I'm with Nrma, I have my home contents, vehicle and business covered with them.
Cracks cannot form under compression, there has to be tension present for a crack to form. I would say that if that has movement like you say the crack has formed from a stress raiser internally.
Gaz, you don't have a dog and bark yourself. Any increase in Premium (if indeed any) will be negligible to the cost of replacing or repairing the frame. Put a claim in. It's what you bought insurance for in the first place.
Think I'm gonna break it all down and leave it to the eBay gods!
Surely not?
The claim would either get processed or rejected. The only plausible reason i can think of for rejection is 'general wear and tear' not being part of your cover. You do have the bike as a listed item?
Aren't they advertising at the moment about covering personal items outside of the home if you have mobile cover with them?
Maaaattteeeee! You can always leave the bike at a mates place and say it was stolen from, well anywhere. You'll get your coin without the hassle of fleabay, your mate will get parts he can fleabay for the inconvenience of leaving a crack'n'fail (gee, I wonder how they got that name?) at his house, and you'll be doing NRMA a favour by showing their advertising campagne has worked, thereby justify the millions they have spent on it. Winners all round. (You know where I live)
Not that I would be advocating that you or anyone else should partake in fraudulent activities, of course.
Yes, the bikes have recently been added.
@ Kit, would have been a nice idea before I plastered it all over a public forum!
Anyway, you know me, I'm not the kind of person who would get involved in any fraudulent shennanegans!!
An upstanding pillar of the community I am!
you will never see it again....
It would be good training trying to keep up with you
$1000 still stands.
p
This is their website: http://www.carbonbikerepair.com.au/
There is a bike repair place that does know about cracks in carbon. Very interesting site, Phil. For $280 its a bargain for a full bike Ultrasonic scan,(might not want the full scan - don't want to uncover other defects) and if they are going to give you a report the meets the Australian Standard.
I would send them the photo mainly to ask whether they could repair that area and how much? If they can repair it and then re-ultrasonic inspect and nil indications are present. Good to go and you will have a report.
They are using (as per the video) Krautkramer USN50L. This isn't cheap equipment, and is quite complicated to use, quite commonly used in Aviation. I have used this equipment and it is very good.
Gazza
Just bog it up mate!
Well, if there's movement when you apply the brakes that seals the deal. Bugger.
Luescher would be worth a call to see what kind of spend could be expected - might still be worth your while.
Tell me about the fork - is it one of the PBR units?
It's the new Opi with the one peice forged upper and one peice lower.
Same internals as the carbon but not much heavier.
Going on eBay on Sunday unless I get a reasonable offer?
It hasn't had that much of a flogging. Only raced once and only ridden about once every three weeks since I got it.
Gazza, are you sure it is a one piece forged upper and a one piece lower, I mean, have you checked them for cracks as well?
The guy in victoria apparently offers a 5 year warranty on his repairs. Looks like it must be the flex in the stay that is putting the strain on the brake mount. My guess would be that it could be fixed fairly easily as its just the join between the two components that cracked i.e. not a structural member.
I have had lots of fiberglass stuff repaired over the years including things with carbon in them without any drama afterwards. So its either repair, wall art or give it to someone else to get repaired. Its a cannondale after all and deserves to fail catastrophically (not some wuzzy crack in a brake mount).
There's a decent article about this topic in the latest MTB Australia mag. Also lists a few repairers (of whom some are ex-aero carbon experts).
I have had a bike repaired at Quantum cycles, the shop looks very basic, but its tool heaven.
Give him a try, he had other carbon frames hanging in different stages of repair, he also resprays and is a master builder.
good luck.......
But I've decided to break it all down and keep some of the parts and sell the rest, selling the cracked frame, fork, wheels and a few other things. Think I'll leave it to the eBay gods and see what I get?
I'll give you a tenner for the frame, as is.
I'll also throw in this video link http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=uVA9DF2JjJc as a reminder of your misplaced youth
But thanks for the video!
HEY GAZZA,
how did you go with the sell off of your frame?