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Manly Dam - Authorised Changes
How the track rides, what lines we take and how they are shaped is something we are all passionate about.
We have a meeting with Council next week including reps from clubs and NobMob.
The purpose of this meeting is to look at future trail works and many of the issues in the other thread.
Can people post photos of key sections of track such as the BBQ patio and 19th Hole and any other favourate segments with diagrams and show what they regard as key beginner and more advanced lines.
Others can also comment. The photos also document what is there currently.
This way we can take this on board at the preliminary meeting. If you want to be more involved PM me.
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While I enjoy gunning it down the section that joins the Allambie fire trail to the top of the 19th Hole rocks and hucking off some of the drops along the way, it is a fall line trail and turns into a set of rapids whenever it rains anything more than a light drizzle.
Currently it is a picture of unsustainability.
It would be nice if the section could be re-routed into a contour line trail, with maybe a couple of hairpins/switchbacks to end up on the rock platform further west. Running along the rock platform would join up with the top of 19th Hole near the current C-line, and the A and B line options would be accessible with a slight turn to the left, upslope.
Spindog and I have investigated the remains of the almost overgrown walking trail that takes you from near the the current entrance to the rock platform, but when I reviewed the GPS plot, it was apparent that it too would become a fall line trail (like most old walking trails), so we'd need to use a "clean sheet of paper" approach to designing the corridor.
The current fall line trail would then need to be closed and rehabbed *properly*.
Some clean fill fashioned into water bars retro-fitted to the electrickery authority access bulldozer trail would complete the supply side of the water management issues that make a mess of the bottom of 19th.
I dont know much about trail sustainability etc but maybe take a look at the bit of trail just past the school. That bit of trail is always a mud bath after it has rained and becomes an absolute mess really quickly.
It has had a lot of pools form over the last 12 months and there is no real way for the water to drain away.
I also believe that the steep climb, not long after this section of trail i mention above, could probably be looked at as i think it forms a water fall during heavier rain. I believe the trail above it would act as a drain and dump water all over the climb, causing it to erode quite badly. I know you used to go left to get up it but after some of the recent down pours the best way up is now to stay to the right
I really needed to learn what each part of the trail was called before i moved hey
I really miss riding Manly Dam 
I agree, Brad - it can be hard to describe certain parts of the track . It would be good to get a map and have the track broken down into sections and have them named properly.
I think something else that needs attention is the climb up from the golf course rock. This bit here - http://nobmob.com/node/9895
It used to be just the lines to the left of the metal pole. Then the easier line to the right started opening up. This needs to be sign-posted with A, B and C lines so that beginners know to go to the right and more advanced riders can take the lines on the left without fear of people building up the steps with loose rocks.
Then there's the bit just beyond that, the climb to the top near the parkway here - http://nobmob.com/node/5597
Random rocks also keep appearing here in the middle of the steps. This constantly throws off my momentum and makes it harder to make the climb. I think maybe some signage for different lines could be good here too.
That section from Manly Vale Public School to Water Reserve Road used to be pretty weather proof - just puddles for a few days. It was also a more interesting and challenging ride.
But then they (RTA? Council? Bush Fire Brigade?) widened, graded and dumped crushed rock on it, removed the obstacles and made it an "all weather access" road with waterbars at regular intervals. The first section now fills and ponds and holds water for weeks: one day it will own the name "quagmire".
They also removed the boulders on the pinch climb (you used to have to do a switchback to ride up) took the boulders and bollards away from the top (a really technical little section) and built a taller water bar right across. So now that top waterbar overflows in a sheet down the grade, washing and eroding as it does - hence different ride lines after each solid downpour.
FWIW Here's your Trail Sustainability lesson for Today:
The section of track we are discussing here shows the result of doing the opposite
At risk of sounding rude its pretty obvious that the idea is to stop water from flowing quickly and in large amounts. And as stated by you they have done quite the opposite in that part of the trail.
As a result it has widened considerably over the 2 years i have been riding it. Apart from the widening of the fire trail it seems to have coped as well as can be expected, but it still would be great to have it on the list, although quite a way down the list i guess, as it isnt really a high priority.
I think the climb we are referring to, and the trail above it, could afford to be further up the list though as it has eroded considerably over the last 6 - 8 months.
There is also the quagmire towards what i refer to as the end of the trail. There is a small tech climb just after it, and where the downhill run starts. I am pretty sure this is already no the radar and may very well require a boardwalk to sort it out
...so "on the radar" is correct. It remains to be seen how well it works (there were puddles at both ends yesterday after rain the night before).
I think Simon's thread has two sub categories here (1) how to repair/maintain existing sections of the track, and (2) new line options in sections to promote flow, allow different skill levels to peacefully coexist and allow overtaking where possible.
On your "pretty obvious" statement - I'll leave it as obvious that "the obvious" is not what was officially, deliberately and at great expense done
Forgetting the maintenance side of things, how do you think they would feel about modifying the trail to include some more features? extra lines etc
Maybe some additional lines could be scouted out for some more tech features, or some extra B lines. While doing the scouting maybe some more drops may be found that could quite easily be included in the trail. Maybe the use of some old walking trails that could add some variety and allow a few different loops to be made available.
I dont know, i am just throwing it out there i guess and thinking out aloud. I have never actually walked the trail, nor done a slow lap to take in the surrounds (which is a shame to be honest) so have no real idea just how easily it could be included.
I also know a fine line needs to be walked from all perspectives but if the trail had some additional, or new features, it might just get me to make the 2 hour drive up once a month
BUdgetary constraints is obviously a massive factor as well and we dont want to be seen an starting to get greedy and get the locals off side
What would be the possibility of building single track through the bush land from the pinch climb to the end of Bangaroo St instead of having to use the house access rd and bitumen rds? Is this land protected in some way? Also same for area opposite Nth Balgowlah School until the start of the Lanterne Rouge climb.
Now I think there could be 3 threads to Simon's "Manly Dam - authorised changes"
1. repairs/maintenance/weatherproofing
2. alternative line options/signs
3. new tracks
Your two track suggestions have been on my mind too recently - they are definitely walkable so they could become rideable one day. But I think there would be a lot of resistance to additional tracks so it would be a long hard sell to make it happen. FWIW you could also do a singletrack beside the downhill road from Wakehurst Parkway to the Creek - again it is already walkable.
Those areas you mention on the list, starting at least from Water Reserve Rd leading into Kalaui St, if not from King St to avoid the Arana/Gibbs St road sections. We also have in mind moving the track off the path and into the bush where it goes past the Bantry Reserve playing fields. Gets quite hectic there with weekend sports and kids darting into your path without looking can be a worry.
The bush is compromised in most of those areas anyway by being so close to houses and roads, so ecological value issues are unlikely to feature prominently as a reason for not doing it, it's more likely to be political and budgetary issues that constrain.